New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Gary1955 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 8:51 pm

I just replaced the stock cuing device with a new Jelco and had to raise the VTA tower to remove the old device. My HR-X table has the dual pivot installed but I have no directions for it. My question is can the dual pivot point be left contacting the metal pad while checking and adjusting vertical tracking force or does it have to be raised up so it does not touch while checking VTF? Where can I get a copy of the dual pivot instructions?

Thank you!
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby baddog » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:07 pm

Link to instructions:

http://www.elusivedisc.com/vpi-r0009-manual.pdf

http://www.analogueseduction.net/user/products/large/rand/vpi-r0009-manual.pdf

As to your other question, given your situation, I would say yes it can be left contacting the metal pad. I would also say that since you are changing the height of the VTA tower you should re-check the dual pivot as well after finalizing VTA height.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Stringreen » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:28 pm

Actually, I'm having some difficulty stabilizing the 2nd pivot on my 3D. Everytime I check it with the Foz, its off. Actually, I easily can hear when its off...blurred sound, left side more prominent than the right, loss of air and dimension. I have used Loctite (222 purple) on the adjusting screw, and yet, it needs to be readjusted. I can't think of what else it could be, but I advise all to retest their own 2nd pivot for proper adjustment.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Dorian » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:15 pm

Glad I stayed away from the dual pivot, seems like more trouble than it’s worth. Hope you get yours fixed.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby jonathanb » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:17 pm

Mine's been solid since I installed it.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Brf » Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:47 am

Stringreen wrote:Actually, I'm having some difficulty stabilizing the 2nd pivot on my 3D. Everytime I check it with the Foz, its off. Actually, I easily can hear when its off...blurred sound, left side more prominent than the right, loss of air and dimension. I have used Loctite (222 purple) on the adjusting screw, and yet, it needs to be readjusted. I can't think of what else it could be, but I advise all to retest their own 2nd pivot for proper adjustment.


When you adjust the dual pivot a second time, do you need to break the loctite seal? If not, it sounds like the loctite is not doing the job.

BTW, I've never has to re-adjust my dual pivot and I use teflon tape to create a higher tolerance friction fit
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby JimTimP » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:23 pm

Stringreen wrote:Actually, I'm having some difficulty stabilizing the 2nd pivot on my 3D. Everytime I check it with the Foz, its off. Actually, I easily can hear when its off...blurred sound, left side more prominent than the right, loss of air and dimension. I have used Loctite (222 purple) on the adjusting screw, and yet, it needs to be readjusted. I can't think of what else it could be, but I advise all to retest their own 2nd pivot for proper adjustment.


Do you adjust the VTA record to record? If you do, you change the distance from the mounting point on the tone arm to the slide plate. This will change your azimuth, and explain why you are seeing this issue.

Once you get the VTA set for the tonearm, while using the 2nd pivot, don't change the VTA, or live with this issue. As people like BRF have repeatedly stated in these forum, you do not need to readjust VTA once set for your table. The amount of change from record to record is insignificant.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Brf » Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:15 pm

JimTimP wrote:Do you adjust the VTA record to record? If you do, you change the distance from the mounting point on the tone arm to the slide plate. This will change your azimuth, and explain why you are seeing this issue.


Just to clarify, changing VTA does affect azimuth (ever so slightly, but is does change) due to the stylus not being inline with the pivot (headshell offset) but it does not affect the relationship between the dual pivot point and skate plate as both move in tandem when vta is adjusted.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Gary1955 » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:32 pm

Thank you to all of the above who responded!
Much appreciated.
VPI HR-X rim drive w/magnetic drive platter, 3D Ref. 12" tonearm, Lyra Titan-i cartridge, Graham Slee Reflex M & Elevator, tri-amped horn system w/electronic crossover.
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Re: New Cuing Device and Dual Pivot Point

Postby Stringreen » Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:11 am

Nope - I adjust only the screw for azimuth to make it right..I check the Foz. We'll see what happens tomorrow. The Loctite adjusting screw turns, but with force. I'm sure it's holding enough not to randomly change by itself.
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