Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby JRM » Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:13 pm

My dealer could not work out a solution for my VPI Signature Scout 2 table. The last recommendation from VPI was to try to adjust the pivot pin height to compensate for the damping fluid well interfering with the new 3D arm. My concern is the result of miss-alignment of the entire tonearm (Tonearm no longer level, cueing assembly would become non useable, VPI jig would become no longer useable, VPI alignment procedure would be no longer useable and easy swap out of tonearms impossible). I wrote to VPI via their site email address with no response. I was previously under the understanding that the pivot pin assembly could just be easily swapped out. This has become very discouraging for me. I hope that VPI could either provide a solution or just inform me that that the 3D armwand is not compatible with my turn table.
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby thegage » Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:23 pm

I don't understand why your dealer couldn't work out a solution. As Brf notes, it should be very simple. I went from a JMW 10.5i with damping well to a 10" 3D arm. All I had to do was remove the damping well/pivot assembly and install a new single spike. It is my understanding that the 9" arm replacement should be the same. Am I missing something?

John K.
TNT 3, 10" 3D arm, Soundsmith Zephyr MIMC Star, Classic Platter, VPI Ring, Stillpoints LPI, TerraCones feet, Phoenix Eagle/Roadrunner, Moon 310LP, Parasound JC2, SMc DNA 0.5, GE Triton 2+, Grover Empress cables, SRA and Symposium Platforms
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby husafreak » Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:45 pm

Two things to remember about VPI, one is they are hard to get ahold of and the other is you can do anything with one of their tables, with their help, of course. So stay patient and stay positive and keep chipping away at it, eventually you will get what you want.
I think that a lot of dealers get frustrated with this and would rather not get involved. It has been this way since I purchased my first table from them about 25 years ago. I just accept it and press on. It is amazing to me what they have accomplished. I think that is partly because they would rather be in the shop creating than doing all the other things it takes to run a business.
Maybe call and speak to Jay at SoundStageDirect? He and Seth seem to have a really good relationship with VPI.
VPI Scout 2/JMW9-3D arm/Sumiko Blackbird/VPI Periphery Ring/HRX record weight/Pheonix Falcon PSU/Timber Nation Maple Isolation Platform/Target Wall Stand/VPI HW-16.5/Ortofon 6NX-TSW-1010/Krell KSL/KSL phono/KST/XLOPro/Harbeth SHL5+
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby Mat » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:17 pm

Hey JRM,

Sorry about the issue you are having. Someone hasn't shot you over a message yet, I'll make sure we get on this tomorrow to get you back up and running :)
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby husafreak » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:19 am

:)
VPI Scout 2/JMW9-3D arm/Sumiko Blackbird/VPI Periphery Ring/HRX record weight/Pheonix Falcon PSU/Timber Nation Maple Isolation Platform/Target Wall Stand/VPI HW-16.5/Ortofon 6NX-TSW-1010/Krell KSL/KSL phono/KST/XLOPro/Harbeth SHL5+
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby husafreak » Fri Dec 01, 2017 2:28 pm

Well the answer is probably yes! I received the 9" 3D arm and for my setup it required 3 turns counterclockwise of the female bearing, looking down from the top, or "looser", or effectively raising the female bearing cup, to get the back of the 3D arm low enough that I could use the VTA ring to fine tune VTA. There is a description how to in the VPI website FAQ's showing how to do this. I need to get another cartridge for my non 3D arm and will have to make the vta adjustment on it via the female bearing cup but I haven't done that yet, it's a "no priority" job at this point.
The 3D arm sounds fantastic. I should probably leave it at that... I'll add that the first thing I noticed was the soundstage was wider and deeper, images larger, actually life size. This was after a TLAR (that looks about right) install. That is still the biggest impression, images are life size and better defined. Everything is just rock solid. Then I got busy with the fine tuning and realized more gains in the "lifelike" department. For me I am getting into the territory where the realism of a good recording is completely convincing. I am not getting the hyper detail that a lot of really high end rigs can achieve, not getting technicolor sounds or transients that make you jump. I hear a breath or a squeak or an echo, but still low in the mix. Maybe that is a good thing. That may also be due to my system, I did choose Harbeth speakers after all. That kind of presentation can be a bit too much, distracting, unforgiving. So anyway, it is still a warm sounding rig and that is fine with me. The really sweet notes, often high ones, Ella for instance, just soar and disappear in a way that is new to me, I often am not sure when I stopped hearing them. But yeah, the realism is definitely up the ladder from where I was at. Classical music is a blast with the perfect placement of instruments and gorgeous sound quality really more noticeable in the huge and deep soundstage. And those notes definitely have more character, more harmonic purity, more solidity. So I definitely feel that I am at the limit of what can be achieved with a modest rig, an affordable rig. It's not a Classic or a Prime but it fits my built in wall shelf and will sit there for a looong time. I imagine it is very close in capability to one of those tables in the 4-5k range. It is quite captivating really, lots of Oh wow! moments due directly to the enhanced realism.
VPI Scout 2/JMW9-3D arm/Sumiko Blackbird/VPI Periphery Ring/HRX record weight/Pheonix Falcon PSU/Timber Nation Maple Isolation Platform/Target Wall Stand/VPI HW-16.5/Ortofon 6NX-TSW-1010/Krell KSL/KSL phono/KST/XLOPro/Harbeth SHL5+
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby JimmyL » Fri Dec 01, 2017 2:55 pm

It sounds like quite a change! Congrats.
I also messed around with adjusting the female bearing cup to fit a new arm. I haven't yet made the final adjustment and assume to get the arm lowered as much as possible, to lower the CG, before the arm has any contact with the base.
Have you had any chance to compare the 9" and 10" arms to see what improvements are gained? I haven't yet had the chance to hear a 3D arm but yours and many others, certainly suggest it's well worth the journey and cost.
VPI HW19 mod’ed MK3 w/10.5i, Ortofon MC25FL, Musical Paradise MP501 V2 Integrated Tube amp, MP Tube Phono Pre, MP Tube D1 DAC, Harbeth P3esr’s
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby JRM » Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:17 pm

I am glad that you were able to use the 3D arm on your Scout 2!

I wonder if the 9 inch Fatboy would be compatible with the Signature Scout 2 since the 9 inch 3D arm is not. This would cost approximately 3 times the cost of the original TT and may require a larger footprint which may not fit into my cabinet. I also wonder if the arm base would require drilling a new hole as well.
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby Mat » Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:42 pm

This is great to read! And the JMW 9 Fatboy sure will be :)
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Re: Are the JMW-9 and JMW-9 3D arms interchangeable?

Postby husafreak » Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:56 pm

Sounds promising JRM :) And to the other, no, I couldn't compare a 9" and 10" arm. The Classic or prime guys would have the 10" arm and in theory it should be an improvement but I doubt the 9" arm gives up much. It is a wonderful arm. The point is really that I am getting great results with a Scout.
Thanks for your reply Mat, it is really neat to have a dialog with the creative mind(s) behind VPI. I get that with my Harbeth loudspeakers too. Alan Shaw is very involved with his forum as well.
And a shout out to the gang at Soundstage Direct. They are the guys who told me it would work and helped me get it done. Them and this forum.
VPI Scout 2/JMW9-3D arm/Sumiko Blackbird/VPI Periphery Ring/HRX record weight/Pheonix Falcon PSU/Timber Nation Maple Isolation Platform/Target Wall Stand/VPI HW-16.5/Ortofon 6NX-TSW-1010/Krell KSL/KSL phono/KST/XLOPro/Harbeth SHL5+
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